Welcome!

Welcome to the official BlackBerry Support Community Forums.

This is your resource to discuss support topics with your peers, and learn from each other.

inside custom component

Native Development

Reply
BlackBerry Development Advisor
elena_laskavaia
Posts: 417
Registered: ‎10-27-2010
My Device: PlayBook

NDK Usability feedback

Guys I am looking for usability feedback for out of box experience with NDK. Since we don't have survey feature here so I will use forum for this.

 

- How was your installation experience?

- How was your initial setup experience?

- What did you like? What you don't like?

- What do you think we can improve?

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

 

Some other questions I am interested in:

- Do you use simular, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somenody else's device?

 

Please post on the forum or send me private forum e-mail, thanks!

Please use plain text.
Developer
superdirt
Posts: 541
Registered: ‎05-17-2009
My Device: Not Specified

Re: NDK Usability feedback

Hi Elena,

 

- Installation was easy. I was exploring the AIR SDK and the NDK at the same time, and the NDK is far easier to install. There were no hiccups with the NDK installation.

- The setup is well documented and I had no problems except for one issue with getting the keys registered and one issue with the bar descriptor file. Those problems were entirely my fault because I was not following the documentation.

- The API reference in Momentics is fast and very handy. Although it seems the online version is richer. It would be nice to be able to get the API documentation in Momentics updated. Maybe there is an auto-update feature and I'm not seeing it.

- I don't see major areas for improvement other than the auto-update of the documentation point I made above, because I am still early on in my NDK development.

- This is probably the best SDK I have used so far (but maybe I am just getting better at using these things). Realistically, I had PB apps running a few hours of downloading. QNX is robust and mature, so I haven't been trying to learn the NDK while having to worry about a million framework bugs. The NDK is easily one of my favourite SDKs.

- I primarily use the device via WiFi, and sometimes the simulator. The simulator is useful for testing some things for my particular application, but when my application reached a certain stage, I could only use the device for testing.
- This is my first BB tablet SDK.

- Haven't imported backup signing keys or debug tokens.

- Later I may be generating debug token for other people's devices.

 

Looks like I was typing another post as you were typing yours (the top post on the page):

 

http://supportforums.blackberry.com/t5/Java-Development/DevCon-update-BB-Java-is-dead-no-java-suppor...

 

It's general feedback on the NDK and more directed to those familiar with BBOS, but it answers some of the questions you have asked outlines most of my thoughts on the NDK.

 

Scott

Please use plain text.
Developer
cycletronic
Posts: 113
Registered: ‎03-23-2011
My Device: Playbook, Z10
My Carrier: Platinumtel

Re: NDK Usability feedback

- How was your installation experience?

Quite good.  I installed on Windows XP and Ubuntu, and had no installation problems at all.

 

- How was your initial setup experience?

Not too bad.  I had some trouble with signing keys because the keys I had were created long ago (March) and did not have the author name in them.  The tool did not want to import them, so I just got new keys, and all was well.  I can't imagine that this is a problem for anybody new coming in.  After I got that problem solved, everything else was smooth and I was able to get the cocos2d-x example running quickly.

 

- What did you like? What you don't like?

I like that it's an eclipse-based IDE, because I'm already familiar with it.  I did feel like it took a while to get from installation to the point where something is running on the device because of all the signing key and debug token setup, but it's reasonable.  If someone has working keys already I think the process is quick enough, but having to get new keys added some time to this.

 

- What do you think we can improve?

Adding a shortcut path to deploy a "hello world" example on the device/simulator without having to setup signing keys and debug tokens, etc., I think would help.  I like to know that something will work before investing lots of time in it.  This is not a big deal though, and I think it is good enough as it is.  I would prefer to see polish elsewhere in the NDK than in the installation/setup process.

 

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

For mobile development I have only used the command-line AIR SDK for the playbook, and this NDK is much nicer.  To compare it to desktop development, I'd say it is very good, and perhaps only falls behind in creating the layout visually (where buttons, text fields, etc. are positioned) like QT designer and the Visual Studio tools.  I do not have needs for such tools yet, so it's really a thought experiment.  I like the NDK very much, and have had lots of fun using it.

 

Some other questions I am interested in:

- Do you use simular, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

No simulator, device via usb in WinXP and device via wifi in Ubuntu about equally.

 

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

I had the AIR SDK before, and the beta NDK.

 

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

I tried to import from backup (as explained earlier) but I think since the key was so old and the command line tools for creating keys were still changing, so the tool could not import.  I did successfully import a debug token across machines, though (XP to Ubuntu).

 

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somenody else's device?

No.

----------------
WIP game: Melodaeum
My graphically bland but very useful Morse Code trainer: Speed CW
My graphically attractive but boring game: The Rainstorm
Please use plain text.
Developer
Harry_Dodgson
Posts: 151
Registered: ‎10-26-2010
My Device: Bold 9900
My Carrier: AT&T

Re: NDK Usability feedback

Hi,

 

I had no issues installing it on my MacBook.

setup was okay - better on 1.0 than the beta.

 

likes:

  popups with function/struct definitions is nice to see what is supposed to be there.

dislikes:

  like the phone SDK, there is no shortcut key to build just the current project.

  depending on how a line is edited, a warning or error will persist being flagged on the left side.

 

It's not as nice as the SDKs for the phones which are more helpful for beginners.

 

I'd like some easy way to see what functions are available as opposed to hunting through the file system for the include files.  Does the editor have folding?  That would be useful.

 

I use it with the simulator and device via wifi.

I also use the Flash SDK via command line.

I've used debug tokens (created via command line) and signing keys (that I use for my Flash projects)

No, I don't need debug tokens for other devices (unless RIM offers me another one for free)

 

Harry

 

--------------
Accepted PlayBook Applications: Marmi-doos, BASIC, Run and Hide
Please use plain text.
Developer
KenSalmon
Posts: 114
Registered: ‎08-09-2010
My Device: Tour
My Carrier: Bell

Re: NDK Usability feedback

- How was your installation experience?

  - No problems, installed on both Linux (Ubuntu) and Windows 7

 

- How was your initial setup experience?

  - No problems

 

- What did you like? What you don't like?

  - Like: Eclipse based, as I have been an Eclipse user for several years

  - Like: Being able to install on platforms I use (Linux, Windows)

 

- What do you think we can improve?

  - More clarity on which third-party or open-source libraries are included, what portions are not yet implemented

  - For example: NDK announcement says OpenAL is available, simultaneously OpenAL appears on Github, leading one to think we have to build it from there, while the headers and libs are actually bundled with NDK, but not on the 1.0.7 device (but apparently are on the 2.0 beta for the device)

- Need more code samples, such as on Github, particulary with using libraries...the examples for playing sounds are extremely primitive (perhaps I could supply a short sample for playing a demo sound via OpenAL)

  - The IDE has issues with falsely flagging errors, as previously discussed...workaround is to use "Rebuild Index" but this needs to be fixed (BTW I did try to report this in issue tracker, but following Mark's posting on how to do that, I could not find a sub-area for IDE issues...maybe that was a temporary glitch?)

  -  I like to keep source files in a directory hierarchy under src...very often, when Building a project, the IDE collapses the expanded directory structure in the Project Explorer pane, for no good reason

  - The IDE prompts for secure storage password when I first launch, and then try to right-click for a context menu, resulting in a modal dialog under a menu popup, which takes a couple of extra clicks to clear

  - Seemingly at random, when doing "Run As...", a dialog pops up to enter the device password, even when the connection is continous, no other problems...it just seems to be random

 

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

  - It is pretty much all inclusive, though the IDE portion has some rough spots

  

 

- Do you use simular, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

  - Mostly using device via usb now, sometimes wifi...rarely use the sim anymore

 

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

  - Have used and deployed with AIR NDK since before the PlayBook launch

 

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

  - Yes and yes, no issues so far

 

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somenody else's device?

  - No

Please use plain text.
BlackBerry Development Advisor
elena_laskavaia
Posts: 417
Registered: ‎10-27-2010
My Device: PlayBook

Re: NDK Usability feedback

>  like the phone SDK, there is no shortcut key to build just the current project.

You can define your own shortcut. Go to Windows->Preferences type Keys in the filter.

Type "Build Project" in command field, and enter keys (i.e. Ctrl+B) in the Binding field. Press Apply.

 

>I'd like some easy way to see what functions are available as opposed to hunting through the file system for the include files.  

There are multiple thousands of functions. I think you can start in docs and look at areas your need functionality.

See https://bdsc.webapps.blackberry.com/native/documentation/com.qnx.doc.native_sdk.devguide/com.qnx.doc...

 

>Does the editor have folding?

Yes. Go to Window->Prefereces, type Folding. Open C++->Editor->Folding and Check Enable folding when opening a new editor

Please use plain text.
Contributor
Jyaif
Posts: 14
Registered: ‎11-11-2011
My Device: Playbook
My Carrier: ?

Re: NDK Usability feedback

- How was your installation experience?

Good.

 

- How was your initial setup experience?

OK.

At first the IDE couldnt connect to the vm, and somehow the ip adress in the vm kept changing. Now it works though.

 

- What did you like? What you don't like?

Like: Eclipse. Vmware (snapshots are useful). Good support of open source libraries.

 

Don't like:  Why do we have two different kinds of projects: C and C++? Why can't we have just one? Also, none of the projects appeared in the "C C++converter" utility, so I had to do it by hand.

 

- What do you think we can improve?

Please handle this:

http://supportforums.blackberry.com/t5/Native-SDK-for-BlackBerry-Tablet/Errors-reported-by-Momentics...

It made me waste so much time. All my other problems are insignificant compared to this one.

 

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

I haven't used this SDK for long, but from what I can tell:

It's obviously better than Samsung's Bada SDK (which does everything wrong).

It's also better than the Android NDK (with all the JNI BS).

The iOS SDK is better, but it uses a lot of Apple specific stuff, so it takes longer getting use to.

 

- Do you use simular, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

Simulator for now.

 

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

First blackberry tablet SDK

 

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

no

 

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somenody else's device?

no

 

 

Please use plain text.
New Contributor
mkm_dz
Posts: 7
Registered: ‎10-18-2011
My Device: Playbook
My Carrier: Iusacell

Re: NDK Usability feedback

How was your installation experience?

Installation was easy, very friendly and no errors

 

- How was your initial setup experience?

This was a real pain. ON MAC OSX it just doesnt work with libraries, the syntax verifier show bugs and errors in C native classes ( bool, int, etc), building works but the IDE itself just need too much "after install" setup

 

- What did you like? What you don't like?

-LIKE: Based on eclipse, quick

DONT LIKE: problem mentioned in the previous questions

 

- What do you think we can improve?

DEBUGGER! it needs a lot of improvements

 

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

7/10 being 10 the best IDE i ve used

 

 

- Do you use simular, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

wifi and simulator

 

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

beta and air

 

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

yes

 

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somenody else's device?

nop

Please use plain text.
Developer
rcmaniac25
Posts: 1,804
Registered: ‎04-28-2009
My Device: Z10 (STL100-4)-10.2.1.2174, Z10 (STL100-3)-10.3.0.700 Dev OS, Z30 (STA100-5)-10.3.0.700 Dev OS, PlayBook (16GB)-2.1.0.1917
My Carrier: Verizon

Re: NDK Usability feedback

- How was your installation experience?

Easy, running on Windows, ran installer and didn't have any issues with it... Well one... (see don't like)

 

- How was your initial setup experience?

The setup experience was easy.

 

- What did you like? What you don't like?

I like the simplicity of the install, I dislike that spaces can't be in the folder path. I understand the whole development side and that you shouldn't have spaces in development folders. But at the same time, as a developer, I know how to handle folder/file names with spaces on Windows/Linux/Unix/etc. and fail to see why folder names must be space-free.

 

- What do you think we can improve?

Support spaces in folder names.

 

- How this is compared to other SDK's you used?

Much better. The BBOS SDK is good, but between the specific Eclipse version and the changing between "download the full installer to get the plugin" and "go to the update site to get the plugin" it starts to build up and I have run into issues on getting stuff up and running. Air SDK is fine but still requires contortions to get everything working with the BlackBerry plugins unless you know where the plugin links go.

 

- Do you use simulator, device via usb, device via wifi? Combination of any of this?

I have the same issue as others where the simulator freezes during startup, but otherwise use WiFi (which is great)

 

- Was this your first blackberry tablet sdk or you had other sdks installed before?

Nope, I used the BBOS JDE, BBOS Eclipse plugin (both from 4.7), WebWorks (to try it out), Air, and NDK Beta, and now the official NDK.

 

- Have you used import of signing key feature (from backup) or import of debug tokens?

Yes for debug tokens, no issues.

 

- Do you have a need to generate debug token for somebody else's device?

No, just my own but NDK handles it without issue.

---Spends time in #blackberrydev on freenode (IRC)----
Three simple rules:
1. Please use the search bar before making new posts.
2. "Like" posts that you find helpful.
3. If a solution has been found for your post, mark it as solved.
--I code too much. Well, too bad.
Please use plain text.
Developer
superdirt
Posts: 541
Registered: ‎05-17-2009
My Device: Not Specified

Re: NDK Usability feedback

Another suggestion: when importing files into the workspace through the import wizard, it would be great to have the option of automatically adding the imported files as assets to bar_descriptor.xml. The current method really isn't a big setback for me, but if I were importing thousands of assets I could see me really wanting this feature.

 

Scott

Please use plain text.