Web and WebWorks Development

[icecappacino]

I just need to express here my frsutration and dissatisfaction of RIM's poor attempt here with using Webworks + RIPPLE. It took me almost 1hr to try and use the RIPPLE tool to try to debug and test my Blackberry application with no success. for some reason I am having more luck with Android in Ripple than I can with Webworks. This is truely an utter dissapointment seeing as how I am able to debug and test my blackberry applications in Eclipse using the Webworks plugin which just boggles me that you have discontinued to support. 

Its really not worth in my opinion.

Frustrated Developer.

[jdnoprada]

Of course I couldn't argue with you regarding the stop in support for the eclipse plugin but look on the bright side. Developing your webworks application on any of your preferred text editor + seeing your application updated by simply refreshing ripple (instead of testing your apps on the simulator which takes time to initialize and somehow tedious to update when you did just a little tweak on your app design) + packaging and signing your applications through ripple as well.

With all these in mind, IMHO, RIM did a good job in making developers perform more effectively. (still crosses fingers for a Ripple + Eclipse or something )

[asiayeah]

I was trying to use Ripple, but I found not all WebWorks API are supported on it, e.g. blackberry.io.file

Until it supports 100% of all API, I found it hard to use Ripple. Actually how would Ripple behave if blackberry.io.file is used on it?

Thanks.

[lasterra]

And how to test our own webworks extension? how can we debug our extension inside our webwork app?

I

[jdnoprada]

As of today, ripple is not yet supporting JavaScript extensions. See this following thread.

[icecappacino]

jdnoprada I could agree with you more but the lack of realism in RIPPLES emulator makes me feel more comfortable about using simulators. I'm trying to execute simple tasks in RIPPLE and its driving me crazy. RIPPLE is merely for UI Design which to me is not 100% truthful 

Eclipse was hard but in the end result it gave me more in depth and insight debugging and true application real life testing than RIPPLE ever could. 

But I must say that this is not the case developing for android..which while still had quirks provided a better work experience than with Blackberry.

I really hope RIM ATLEASTS provide an eclipse plugin update for web works...and PLEASE be XP 64bit compatible.

[tneil]

Hi icecappacino,

I will do my best to answer all of your questions.. However, be prepared for the fact that we are not planning on providing plug-ins for Eclipse of Visual Studio going forward.  I understand that you like the Eclipse environment and would prefer to have everything integrated into Eclipse, however we are looking to serve a much wider range of developers, and development environments, and are placing our focus on an non-IDE specific approach with Ripple.

Currently the only piece of functionality that Ripple does not provide that the Eclipse and Visual Studio plug-ins provided, is JavaScript debugging on BB5.  Ripple actually provides much more functionality that what our plug-ins supported.

Build and Launch with Simulators

We will always support packaging/signing and deploying to the simulator directly from Ripple.  This provides the exact same functionality as the plug-ins provided.  This can be accomplished by configuring your WebWorks SDK paths in the "Settings" dialog which is found in the options menu by clicking the "Wrench" icon in the top right corner of Ripple.  You can also select the desired simulator you would like to use when launching.

Once you have your SDK's configured with Ripple you can package/sign and launch by pressing the wrench button and then your action.  This is essentially the same as the "Run and Debug Configurations" that were part of the Eclipse plug-in.

This works with both smartphones and the PlayBook, which is functionality that was not provided with the Eclipse & VS.NET plug-ins.

API and Custom Extension Support

Yes, there are some APIs that are not yet supported inside the Ripple emulator.  File I/O support will be available in the tool in a couple of weeks contained in the beta refresh.  You can still test your application through the simulators for testing APIs that are not yet supported in Ripple.

We are looking at ways to support custom extensions in Ripple.  Currently what I do for my custom extensions is create a JS file that I include in my application that checks if my extension is available, and if not, loads up a JavaScript emulation version of the extension returning my expected values.  This allows me to do the majority of my app testing in Ripple and working with a simple refresh instead of waiting for compile and simulator launch times.

When I am writing and testing my custom JavaScript extension I use the Package and Launch functionality of Ripple to launch the app with the custom extension in the simulator.  This is the same way that I tested my extension before using Eclipse or VS to package/launch the app on the simulator.

Debugging

BB5 devices had a JS debugging layer that could be used with the plug-ins.  BB6 didn't have debugging capability at all. BB7 and PlayBook have built in remote Web Inspector where you can attach directly to your application running on the simulator or on a live device and debug your application.

Ripple also currently supports all Web Inspector capability except for JS breakpoints. JS breakpoint debugging/stepping is also coming in the beta refresh release due out in the next couple weeks.

Running a local Web Site

Currently Ripple requires you to run a local web server to run your application's content.  In the beta refresh due out in a couple of weeks, there will be a designated area that you can use to place your application's contents so that you can either choose to use your own web server, or use the designated area specified for Ripple.

Ripple's Intended Use

Ripple is meant to be a tool to fit into the same patterns if you were building a website and needed to test it with Chrome, Firefox, IE etc.  You author your web content using any code editing environment that you choose and then run the site inside the browser/Ripple, using the built in debugging tools of the browser/Ripple to work out the bugs in your site.

When Ripple falls short for device specific emulation, you can then launch your app in the simulator of your choice to perform your final testing.  

Our goal with the tooling is to continue to reduce the scenarios where Ripple falls short so that you can spend as little time as possible in the simulators and instead have the speed of simply pressing F5/Refresh to test your code.

Desktop Operating System Support

We plan on continuing with support for Mac OS X, Windows XP (32-bit), Windows 7 (32/64-bit).

[icecappacino · Accepted solution]

This is all well and good and if this is how the company chooses to approach their "serving a winder range of developers" then all the best to them...I compare this to Microsofts IE6 days. 

Nothing that you haven't already said influences my stance and only solidify the fact that this approach seeks to undermine the core concept of serving a wider range. 

The current approach lacks full development capabilities meaning we have to still use various other development methods IN ADDITION to adapting this new law in order to yield results. While it is understandable that these things will take time. In this ever fast pace changing mobile race..This has to be the slowest lackadaisical adaptation to the times I've ever come across. 

My biggest disappointment however comes from the fact that you give assurance of not supporting eclipse plugins. For a company that SHOULD have been leading the way in the mobile race is probably tops it even more.

But back to the point. 

Your statements are valor...I applaud blackberry's move forward. 

My only consolation to this whole situation is ....Android( I'm yet to skip over to the other platforms)

Thanks anyway for your ear...as this post was only meant to vent the suffering and pain being endured as a Blackberry developer.

I cannot say whether things will get better if we change; what I can say is they must change if they...

[aliajones]

i ditto for the same i am simply not able to build and launch on a simulator......clueless...nd tried my hand on everything

[aliajones]

does ripple support javascript....my simulator is visible but till,,,my app is not packaging .I am developing for smartphones os7 and i have a simulator suited for the same.What's wrong in my app and y it aint it building